The presence of polybutylene pipes creates uncertainty for potential homebuyers. Trying to figure out what we want to do as well, seems like the options are walk, negotiate it into the repairs, or save to do it in the future :/. However, polybutylene pipes have since proven too fragile to withstand chemicals found in the public water supply. However, many things have to be considered before investing in the house when you find your dream house. PB piping has not been used for drain and sewer lines, nor vent piping. These modified designs used the same PB pipes, but with upgraded joints. Any other advice about this issue and how to handle it? Push-on shut-off valves are a good option for this repair, also. Historically, there has been debate about why poly-pipes have failed. Now that weve looked at the options for selling your house with polybutylene pipes, you can apply them to your circumstances. We figured people in the business would know this stuff so we didn't go into detail. During my over 20-year real estate investing career, Ive dealt many times with properties having this problem. "When I work with a seller in a neighborhood that I know has polybutylene, we always have to check before putting the house on the market," Willard adds. There are two ways in which you can sell a home with polybutylene plumbing; The first option is the easiest way to sell your home. Please include a message before submitting. What to Know When Buying a Home With Polybutylene? Sunday, March 22, 2020 Any defect of a home that materially affects the value or livability of a house must be included in the seller's disclosure form, if known. Some states' disclosure laws are more comprehensive than others, and if a feature isn't on the list the seller may not be required to speak up. They thought that maybe the pipes hand been installed wrong, were defective from the factory, or maybe even damaged by chlorine, fluoride, or other chemical additives to the water. Mandatory disclosure (M) of pipe material (lead not specifically addressed) or lead pipes if seller determines conditions unsafe (Example: State-required form asks, "Type of plumbing system: Copper/Galvanized/Plastic/ Polybutylene./Unknown/ Other") Wisconsin Voluntary disclosure (V) of lead pipes Is a washing machine drain hose required to be secured at the standpipe? What is Polybutylene Pipe? Evidence of that can prove that your seller is liable includes: Timeline testimony from your contractor Better, but not a total solution. ; M.B.A.; J.D. You just have to know who your prospective buyers are, where to find them, and what other factors of such a deal you should consider. This originally came from the court case of Johnson v. Davis, 480 So.2d 625 (Fla. 1985). Polybutylene pipe is a gray plastic tubing that was commonly used as a water-supply plumbing pipe between 1978 and 1995, at which time it was discontinued due to reports of pipes rupturing. If the seller or the home inspector fail to mention that your home has polybutylene plastic water supply lines and crimped fittings you may be able to collect money as part of a class action lawsuit. And if you're not home when a pipe bursts (and it will), this can result in thousands of dollars in water and structural damages. We've spent $3000 on all the inspections and might have to add more to that for bank and attorney's fees (not sure yet about how much that would add). The inspection money has now saved you from buying a house you don't want. The damage occurs along the internal pipe walls. The price of PEX pipes ranges between $0.40 to $2.0 per linear foot, depending on the diameter of the pipe. Because of premature failure leakge problems of PB (polybutylene) pipe that caused class action lawsuits and settlements, along with removal of approval of the pipe in the building codes, the pipe decreases the value of the home. Which water pipes are an insurance problem and possibly uninsurable? The majority of polybutylene plumbing installed is still installed and working fine. If all the plumbing drains have water in them and you can still smell sewer gas, what's causing the problem? What are the code requirements for plumbing vent terminations? However, the seller must be truthful if asked, unless state law allows them to say that they don't wish to answer. Also, construction methods and materials vary in different parts of the country and it is possible that important issues related to your area may not be covered here. This can be a good idea if you have made up your mind about purchasing the house because it is better to get the re-piping done before moving into the home. In our experience - once you have one leak, you are likely facing a systemic issue, and other leaks will follow. Homeowners can determine whether they have polybutylene plumbing systems by looking in the attic, basement, behind the walls or the near the water heater where the plumbing system is exposed. and our a professional plumber will charge between $150 and $500. I did find out that if you're on city water the polybutylene problems can be even worse because chlorine in the municipal water will degrade the pipes even quicker. Visit ourPLUMBINGpage for other related blog posts on this subject, or go to the INDEX for a complete listing of all our articles. Your second choice would be to replace any polybutylene pipes in your property and sell it the traditional way. In this article, I will tell you what must be done to sell yours. Enter a valid a 10-digit phone number as ###-###-####. Their existence is probably (highly debated) an adverse fact (buyers will want to check it carefully, . Messages sent using the form on this site, go directly to our email, which we check regularly. Buying Or Selling A Home With PB Pipes: Polybutylene piping affects a home's value. If it hasn't been long, I believe in some areas both sellers are required to disclose it if they're aware and home inspectors are required to note it if they see it. Its important that you get several offers from reputable investors so that you can compare them and make your choice confidently. No Hot Water: Easy DIY Water Heater Repair Guide, Water Heater Breaker Size: Easy Wire & Breaker Size Guide, Best Laundry & Utility Sink Faucets: Our Top Picks for 2023, How to Unclog a Shower Drain: 7 Ways to Remove a Shower Drain Clog, How Long Plumbing Lasts: When to Replace & Costs. If you are a seller, you should disclose all known conditions that the buyers need to know about the property including the likelihood of leaky pipes. In a hurry? Either copper pipe or PEX tubing are suitable repipe materials, but we find the vast majority of our customers replace their poly pipes with PEX tubing. For more information, please see our This article discussed the issues with polybutylene pipes and how you can replace them yourself. Furthermore, even if your poly pipes never leak, its presence will unfortunatelyimpact your home value and may affect yourhomeowners' insurance policy. You could have your polybutylene pipes working perfectly fine for decades, but insurance companies work along with the concept of large numbers. We will get it done for you. Depending on your market and the condition of your property, they may not offer you full market value for your home. The primary manufacturers of the pipe were Shell Chemical Company, Qest (pronounced "quest"), and Vanguard. As with the second option, which involves replacing your pipes yourself before selling, you must first inspect your pipes. Repipe Specialists - USAState license info available in our location directory. I'm a realtor as well and not aware of any specific polybutylene pipe disclosure form or question on a disclosure that exists; it is a general material defect that requires seller's knowledge. This allowed "jointless" layouts. Posts: 9,889. That buyer will probably want to negotiate the asking price and reduce it because they have to replace the plumbing, costing them extra money. Facts vs. Fiction 8. Some investors are called house flippers. The most significant historical litigation was the Cox v. Shell Oil class-action lawsuit, culminating in close to a billion dollar settlement in 1995, being paid out to thousands of homeowners over subsequent years. If you can find the people they bought it from and see if it was disclosed to them, then you have proof. I'm a licensed Home Inspector, Certified Professional Inspector (CPI), Certified Master Inspector (CMI), and FHA 203k Consultant. By that time millions of homes had already been built using these pipes. We are not affiliated with, and do not receive any compensation from, any of the companies or products mentioned in this blog. E & L Insurance Services, Inc. All rights reserved. They need to have the necessary financial strength and a good track record of closing as agreed. Home inspectors wont do that. To find a minuscule crack in the polybutylene pipes, one would need a very efficient plumber, and even then, it would be not easy to identify. Polybutylene is also not the same as plastic ABS piping commonly used in drain and sewer piping. How does repiping a house work? This type of plastic resin was commonly used in the manufacture of water piping, from about 1978 through the end of 1995, and is known to flake off and deteriorate after several years of use. Because polybutylene pipes will fail, it's just a matter of when it will happen. In short, you don't have to disclose a death in a house in Texas unrelated to the condition of the property, the HIV status of any occupants of the property, and won't be held responsible for any conditions that you are truly unaware of. Does a seller have to disclose polybutylene pipes? They have the knowledge to inspect the house for themselves based on their particular criteria. Not sure a home has poly? However, there are two ways you can sell your home in situations like this. My SO and I have a bid on a house in North Carolina and are in the due diligence period. 3. However, if you know you have poly plumbing - you will most likely need to disclose that fact. Can You Sell a House With Polybutylene Pipes? All I can really say is good luck! VA inspectors are also required to report even the smallest amount of evidence of dry rot, termite or . Contact us to have one of our local estimators provide a free consultation and quote, delivered in-home or remotely. The average cost to replumb a house will vary between $5,000 to $7,000. If you reach our answering service, please leave a message: we return calls in the order they are received. Your first polybutylene leak can happen at any time, even if you've had years of leak-free experience. So there is a big chance that the uncertainty that polybutylene pipes bring to your homes plumbing system will very quickly push your home off the buyers list. How far should stair nosing stick out? Florida case law provides that, with some exceptions, a home seller must disclose any facts or conditions about the property that have a substantial impact on its value or desirability and that others cannot easily see for themselves. It will not definitely fail. The replacement can be estimated to cost somewhere starting from $2,500 and go up to $15,000. We've done many repipes, when insurance companies required it, as a condition of policy renewal or issuance. Since polybutylene pipes are usually found underneath the house, them breaking and cause water leakages will damage the entire house. Licensed Florida Independent Insurance Agent. To have a lawsuit for non-disclosure you must show seller knew and did not disclose. Call our residential repipe division to schedule a free estimate for your home: Or visit our regular residential repipe site to learn more: Repipe Specialists - USA245 E Olive Ave #500Burbank, CA91502. Unless this house is the house of your dreams and no other house will do, you may be better off looking elsewhere. You will have to spend a lot of time, money, and energy trying to repair the pipes. For this, your professional plumber would need to identify polybutylene pipes by excavating them. Since polybutylene pipes are an insurance problem and possibly uninsurable have failed of polybutylene plumbing is! A systemic issue, and energy trying to repair the pipes dream house which involves replacing your pipes a. 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